Overall Development

[Westerken]

I think you have an idea that is compelling, but I am concerned that there seems to be no story arc in development.

If everyone involved is concerned about creating this "cool effect" then the end result is going to be a 90 minute montage. Montages can be compelling for five minutes, but grow tiresome after ten. How are you going to engage the viewer to stay tuned?

The story needs a clear arc. For example - Koyaanisqatsi, arguably one of the best montage films ever produced, is clearly broken into three segments. The first is the beauty of the Earth, the second is the beauty of life and the third is the chaos of society. All of this is tied together by a powerful soundtrack and becomes so engrossing that the viewer literally forgets to blink.

In order to create that type of masterpiece, we need to know before beginning what that arc is going to be and how to get their.

That is my single biggest suggestion. A few further suggestions I have are:

There needs to be a project director who is given carte blanc permission to re-edit or axe material that isn't carrying it's weight in the piece as a whole. Even the ability to order reshoots as necessary.

I would also encourage a working deadline. We'll have a structural outline completed by this date, all clips are due in by this date, and the producers will have a first cut completed by this date.

Have each filmmaker contribute three segments, one for each phase of the arc. That way there is some continuity in visual styles and returning characters for the viewer to tag along with.

You might consider quad splitting the screen in parts to appear to make some events happen simulataneously. Maybe even direct some of the contributing filmmakers to film a scene that will be compiled into a quad. Like film actors doing some benign action and on cue all the action stops and everyone looks up. Or maybe a timed choregraphed scene where different producers in different cities film their actors hitting the same marks at the same time in one single shot that is compiled into a quad shot.

Maybe an MST3K guy greenscreened into the corner of the screen narrating along the gaps. That's a cheesy idea, but it would offer the film simple continuity.

Anyway - those are my starting thoughts.

Ken
www.shortkutzdvd.com

[mattfolwell]

hi there....just so u know oded (filmmaker82) is the 1 with overall say in the project, his idea, his inspiration....though i do agree that some of the stuff needs sorting out beleive me when i say it will in time...2 give u a better idea of this project why not check out the original post from oded and all the follow ups @ www.indieclub.com its on message boards (should b at top!) under international project open 2 all posted by filmmaker82...this should clear up a few areas 4 u .....dont get me wrong i think any suggestions will be gratefully accepted..its just that this project is entirely original and as far as i know an indie like this hasn't been attempted b4 ...so bare with it, its a work in progress! thanx

[astralpictures]

I agree Westerken, that there needs to be a story arc. I said in a different thread that it might make it more interesting if we start off with small, weird things happening and then have the "story" increase in intensity as it goes along. Yes, Oded will have the final say since the main project is his, but I think we all could create something better if we know exactly what type of mood we need to create in our scenes. Like I said, if the whole thing is just 90 minutes of crazy lights in the sky or something very similar, which I have a feeling most people would do, then it won't be as interesting. This is why we need to share our ideas and make sure we aren't all doing the same thing because Oded won't have much to work with if we do.

[Filmmaker82]

Hey there,
Matt, thanks again for clarifying things while I was gone.

Westerken - or just Ken
I think you raised interesting points that everyone would agree with, here are my thought:
I think that creating a story arc and involving everyone in it is actually not such a good idea - a lot of this project is about creativity and freedom and to build a story would significantly lower the amount of those elements. I don't really want to come off and say "okay, this is how it works - there's a three part structure; the coming...the panic...and the end..."
I think labeling scenes and disecting the project that way at this stage is far too early and destructive. I realize, as I am a filmmaker, that this is not a common workplan but then again - this is not a common project.
I have several ideas of what the movie COULD look like at the end, but I think choosing one when I haven't even viewed all the segments is wrong. I have faith that people will create something great and I also have the faith that I will take those creations and merge them into something even greater.
This project takes a leap of faith from everyone, because even though the financial investment in it is low (is it?) the emotional one is high - this project could become something great for all of us, I think it's an original and unique project that was never attempted before. And that gives us an edge. But there will be no reward if there is no risk, and we risk, with every decision that we make, to be wrong. I conceived this idea and I'm the so called "project director" of it...and I can't help but feel that as long as everybody's doing their best we'll end up with something great. I hope you share the feeling Ken.
As fot the amount of segments per filmmaker- I think everyone should do as many segments as they want or can. I don't think forcing them into creating three segments is the right way to go.
I can tell Ken, that you're looking for some sort of discipline here and I think that's an admirable trait in any filmmaker, but it's totally useless on this project.
In order to create something original we need to disregard any other project and we need to disregard any existing format. My original post asked for segments dealing with the phenomenon, it didn't specify what kind, in following posts we talked about creating segments that show various depictions of the phenomenon and segments that deal with people's reaction to it and also so called "post phenomenon" segments...so maybe that will be of some help to you Ken.
A deadline is somewhat necessary but at the moment it would only be a problem, I don't want the filmmakers involved to feel any pressure but certainly this project will not last forever, it wouldn't even last a year. This whole project should be wrapped up withing the next couple of months but I can't and won't pinpoint the exact date for submitting segments just yet. Anyway, once I receive all the segments I will post a deadline for me to present you guys with a "first draft" of the completed project.
You have a lot of great points for discussion Ken and I hope you'll keep posting them,I also hope that I've answered your questions in a satisfying way...let me know.
Oded.

[Filmmaker82]

For anyone just joining us I would suggest reading this thread from the begining - westerken and astralpictures
have read interesting points for discussions...

[msbabu]

I thought this is something new and a very first attempt in film making area. I really impressed with the idea and i want to take part in. But i am not sure where to start.
I have little experience in short film making, and i am doing my film directing course now.

I understood the whole concept of "the coming". But to really shape the concept, i think we should have a baseline story at least with 20 lines. Then every one can pick a point and hook up to hights of the story.

The project director (filmmaker82) can take up a role to finalyze the story so that we all can start making the movie.

For your cleric pls.

thanks

[Filmmaker82]

Hi MSBABU,
I just wanted to stress out a point that I raised before -
to create an totally unique segment you need to think what the coming means to you...what you would think it is...how you would see it...
the reason I did not come up with a story is because I have no idea what sort of segments/scenes I may receive by the time this project goes in to editing...and I'M OK WITH THAT! in fact, that's exactly what I want.
If something like this was to happen in real life and years later footage from around the world was collected this is what it would look like...a bunch of clips...different, somewhat unrelated BUT we know they're all connected to that ONE THING that happened...
What makes this project unique in my mind is also the fact that none of us have any idea what this would look like - I have a little bit of an idea or two but until I see everything everyone has created I really can't tell you what the end result of the film would look like and I find that extremely exciting.
I did HOWEVER state before that if anyone does need a little bit more direction they can always address me personally or take up the three acts structure to help them - what I mean by the 3-acts structure is to try and base your scene in one of the 3 acts:

act I - the begining, something's happening.
act II - the event occurs, whatever it is it's at it's peak at this point, everything happens here.
act III - the aftermath(?)

Now, once you've decided on an act then your interpretation of what the scene should be like, what sort of phenomena is in play here etc etc etc is what will help your sequence become an original one.
I don't want this to be planned, I don't want this to be structured or have a story or characters that we follow throughout the movie, this should be as if we're going all over the world when something weird is starting to happen, is happening or already happened....
The movie itself will come together, trust me on that, but right now I think we should all worry about our own little piece of it and not the big picture because by definition we have no means of knowing what this will look like.
Anyway,
hope this has been of help - write me if not or if you just want to talk more specifically about your segment.
Oded.
[e-mail]

[Filmmaker82]

Hi all,
I wanted to help you guys with understanding the format/design of the project a bit more since you do tend to ask me questions about it quite frequently...
I guess if I had to draw some sort of primary, general plan I would say that the movie has three parts/acts that deal with this "Event" we don't know a lot about...
the first part/act is realising something is wrong....this is actually the beginning of the film when no one knows what's going on or what the film is going to develop into being...
the second part deals with the event itself as it happens...
and the third is after the event, an aftermath of some sort...the results are totally up to you guys,just like determining what sort of event rules your scenes...
NOW - since this is an unusual project, it requires an unusual appriach and I think I'm working up to that point very well, as I'll start editing I'll let you all know what this is shaping up to be like and, of course, when it's done you'll all get a say before we release the final composite. The story is not going to be linear...there won't be any "clean" breaks or transfers from one act to the other...it's going to be edited in a way that wold be exciting to watch not just to think about...this is the sort of movie that would make a terribly weird script but a gr8 viewing experience...
so what I would like you all to do when you have the time is just drop me a line on what part of the "storyline" your scenes deal with...if you have more than one scene then please specify how many and for each of them.
This way I would be able to keep track of what we have and what we need.
Thanks a bunch everybody!
You're all doing a gr8 job and I am so proud to have a team like you guys !
Oded.

[Filmmaker82]

I know I said that there will only be a musical score at the very last few minutes of the film but I think the trailers should also use some sort of score so maybe we can start desigining it...anybody here knows how to get a hold of a film composer that can help us out? I think that since this project has a whole lot of directors working on it expressing different places, different voices - it's only right to have a variety of composers working together to create a composite of different musical voices for the score...
what do you think?
Oded.

[seahorse]

Do You think we should search for more than one composer for the music ?
I think the different sequences will all have their own sound. It could help to bounce them together with one filmmusic. Or the theme " The Coming " is used by different composers. BUT : We should have ONE theme for it ( like the significant STARWARS Theme ) on which many could work.

Just one thought

Seahorse

[Filmmaker82]

I was very clear early on that the segments themselves should have no music...but we do need a THEME and that was my intention by having several composers collaborate.
Now all we need is to find them.
Oded.

[Filmmaker82]

Hi everybody,
I just returned from my trip to Berlin and I'm trying to catch up with all the developments on the project so please dorp me a line and tell me where you're standding and what I can do to help you,
thanks a bunch all!
Oded

[Filmmaker82]

Hi everybody,
I'd love if you can tell me one thing more about your segment -
if it takes place before or after "the major event" has occured (or even during). If you really wanna put a smile on my face you can tell me EXACTLY how long before or after it the segment has occured, though exact timing really doesn't matter.
Oded.